A Pentecostal Pastor Warns of False Prophets and Apostles: Brannon Howse Interviews Bill Randles

Brannon Howse:         Welcome to the program.  Glad you’re with us.  Well, getting a lot of response from our four-part series on the dangers of dominion theology, particularly the new apostolic reformation.  Continuing to do some reading and research over the weekend. 

Got a book in the mail, and you guys might find it interesting to order the – get it as well.  It’s paperback.  It’s 130 pages, 131 pages – 132 pages.  One hundred and thirty-two pages called Beware the New Prophets.  And it’s subtitled A Caution Concerning the Modern Prophetic Movement.  It’s written by Pastor Bill Randles R-A-N-D-L-E-S.  He’s a pastor in Iowa.  He’s a Pentecostal pastor.  He founded an independent Pentecostal church.

But what’s very interesting about his book is he is saying, look, Rick Joyner, Cindy Jacobs, Bill Hamon, Paul Cain, all these different guys that are running around, a part of this movement, are very dangerous.

In fact, he lays out, he says, “Look, whereby would you do these things that you’re claiming to do?  You can only do them by the power of God or the power of Satan.”  And he goes on to layout biblically why these guys are in biblical error, and therefore, their power is not from God.  They can therefore only be from one source.

He goes on to layout how some of the people who gave a rise to the latter reign movement, he believes were clearly involved in the occult and cautions that indeed some of these folks may indeed be involved in the occult because how else is it they’re talking to angels or entities.  And who are these angels?  We don’t talk to angels today; so, therefore, who are they talking to if indeed they are truly talking to someone?

So you – I would not agree that prophets or apostles are at all for today.  I think reading the book, he would say that they could be for today, but I don’t know that he would ever find anybody that he would agree is really truly a prophet or apostle.  So I’m not saying that I would agree with everything that he’s presented in the book, but I did – at the same time, don’t know that he would ever find someone that he would say, “Now, that’s a biblical prophet.  That’s a biblical apostle,” because he’s very, very leery of that. 

Where I would say the opposite, it’s completely closed, as I gave it to you last week from the scriptures, I’m not so sure he would say that.  But he would – he’s certainly saying, look, these guys that are running around claiming to be prophets and apostles, they don’t pass the test.  They’re not.  Period.

So, again, he and I would disagree on some things, that’s for sure, but it is an excellent little book, paperback, that gives you a real understanding for where this whole apostolic movement, new apostolic reformation movement came from, the whole history, including one of their past leaders, William Branham, who started a lot of this and claims to have seen also, again, an angel, someone that he was actually as a child talking to the spirit world or spirits were talking to him, came to him as a child.  And of course that ended up giving the foundation to the rise of people like Oral Roberts and many others.

So it gives you a very good history.  It’s called, again, Beware the New Prophets, and I just ordered it last week off his website.  Don’t remember what the website was that I ordered it from, but I’m sure you can find it if you type in type in “Pastor Bill Randles” R-A-N-D-L-E-S.  And it’s called Beware of the New Prophets.

He lays out some very interesting things that I did not know, and one of them is Promise Keepers.  Now, I did not go to Promise Keepers.  I was not a part of Promise Keepers.  There was something about Promise Keepers that seemed really weird to me, really strange, and I didn’t want anything to do with it.  And to be honest with you, I just have no interest in going with a bunch of guys in a van or a church bus anywhere, period, end of sentence.  I don’t care what they’re doing; I don’t want to go.

I don’t go to men retreats.  I don’t go to men fishing campus.  I don’t go men conferences.  You know, they go off for the weekend.  And great.  If that’s what you want to do, good for you.  You know what?  If I’m going to go somewhere I’m going to take my wife with me.

I guess I’m fortunate enough to have a wife that I thoroughly love.  Been married 20 years next week.  And I’d just as soon not travel without her.  One of the reasons I quit flying and got a Motor Coach was because I wanted to take my wife with me.  I want my wife with me.

So I’m already predisposed not to going to those kind of things because I want to stay at home, or if I go, I want to take my wife with me.

So Promise Keepers right away was something I wasn’t interested in because I’m not interested in going and hanging out with a bunch of guys at some kind of function like that.  It doesn’t mean I don’t go hunt.  Went hunting this last Saturday.  Took my two sons and a couple of their folks.  Glad to do that.  Back home at night.  That’s just the way I prefer to do.

Some folks like to go all the way up to South Dakota for three or four days and hunt and leave their wife behind.  Not interested in that.  If my wife wants to go with us, great, then I’ll go.  So that’s just me personally.  I got married to be married, and I like my wife to be with me.  That doesn’t mean I haven’t traveled many years without her, but because I did travel so many years without her, I’m just not interested in going places without her.  So that’s me personally.

So when Promise Keepers came around, I just wasn’t interested.  But then something seemed awfully odd to me about the whole thing.  Guys getting in a stadium and chanting and cheering and carrying on.  Again, it had the whole football theme, and I’m not a football guy.  I don’t really care about football unless Mississippi State is playing, the occasional Packers game, Vikings, Dallas, those three teams, I’ll kind of keep up with what they’re doing, but not really interested in football and sports.

So the whole idea of getting into a football stadium and screaming and hollering and carrying on with 20,000, 30,000 men just wasn’t of interest to me.  But something seemed odd, to be honest with you, about this Bill McCartney guy.  That’s my personal opinion.  You can completely disagree.  And I was getting reports from friends of mine who live in Northern Virginia, Washington, D.C., and some folks who are on the church – on his Promise Keepers staff about some of the things that were going on there and how decisions were being made.

And it seemed to me, my opinion from what I gathered, was it was a lot of emotion.  A lot of emotion. Even the way decisions were made at the Promise Keepers headquarters, from what I was told by folks that were closely connected to staff there, that a lot of stuff was made based on emotion and whim, and this feeling and that feeling, and God told me to do this, or God is leading us to do this, and things that just seemed awfully emotionally experiential to me.  And I’m not saying God doesn’t use the Holy Spirit to lay things on our heart and our mind, but again I got a red flag.

Well, this weekend, here I had no clue.  And maybe you guys knew this, but if you did why didn’t you tell me?  James Ryle R-Y-L-E, James Ryle, is, according to Pastor Bill Randles who wrote this book Beware of the New Prophets, Page 7, he says, “James Ryle, for example, is the pastor of the Boulder, Colorado Vineyard and considers himself a modern-day prophet.  He is also the mentor of Bill McCartney, founder of Promise Keepers.  In fact, Promise Keepers is seen by many as the fulfillment of the prophesies of Paul Cain and Bob Jones, two ‘prophets’ whom you’ll meet later.”

Well, there you go.  I did not know that Bill McCartney would have been in that camp, was, you know, mentored, as according to Pastor Bill Randles, by a guy that calls himself a modern-day prophet.  But that certainly helps to fit with a lot of the things that I kind of was weary about, leery about with Promise Keepers.  So that’s one thing I learned this weekend.

Here’s some other excerpts from this book where he’s quoting some of the books of some of these new apostolic folks.  And quite frankly, this is where we start to see the new age movement and the new world order merging with the apostolic reformation.  And again, this false dominant church being created that I believe will come against true Christians.

Now, we briefly touched on this idea last week, but I have found more in this book where he’s citing their sources and their books.  Listen to what – this comes from personal freedom outreach journal, warning about this belief of the manifested sons of God.  This is this concept, manifested sons of God.  Here’s what they teach.  This newsletter he quotes cites, “At that time, the sons of God,” meaning these new apostolic reformation folks, “will be fully manifested” – let me start again. 

“At that time, the sons of God will be fully manifested on the earth. Widespread spiritual warfare will result with the sons of God doing battle with Satan and company.  The non-Christian nations of the world will also be defeated.  Once the earth has been subdued” – you hear that?  “Once the earth has been subdued, Jesus will come back to earth and given the kingdom that has been won for him by this ‘man-child company’.  The manifested sons of God doctrine teaches that these sons” – listen now, “The manifest sons of doctrine teaches that these sons will be equal to Jesus Christ.  Immortal, sinless, perfected sons who have partaken of the divine nature.  They will have every right to be called gods and will be called gods.”

Folks, I don’t know if you've heard some of these folks, and I’ve had conversations with a few of them over the years, tell me that they can actually be sinless and not sin.  Well, this is where this idea comes.  They actually become the manifested sons of God.  They will actually be perfected sons who have partaken of the divine nature.  They will have every right to be called gods and will be called gods.

This is totally – it helps us to understand how the new apostolic reformation will indeed, I believe, help usher in an ecumenical one-world church, work closely with the Catholic church.  And by the way, what we need to understand is that many of the characteristics of the new apostolic reformation, can be found in the Catholic church.  We can also find many of the ideas of the new apostolic reformation inside the Protestant church.  So before you get your back up, listen.  This whole idea is penetrating the “evangelical” Protestant churches and the Catholic – and has been in the Catholic church for years.

And you can see how the gap can be bridged for these groups to come together under one denomination really, one movement, a one-world religion.

Here’s another quote.  This comes from a quote in the book called Joel’s Army.  “The last enemy to be conquered is death.  Who will conquer it?  A mature church will come forth with a kind of authority and power that will be able to stand in the very face of Satan.  When the church reaches the level of maturity, God will be able to say this generation of the church does not need to die.  She has reached the place of maturity.  I will translate her because her maturity pleases me.”

And what you will have, they teach, is this army of – this Joel’s Army, basically these people that are superhuman.  They are superhuman.  Now, can you not see how this also will fit in with trans-humanism?  The post-human?  And by the way, did you not see the piece in Time magazine this week, and I put it up on our website over the weekend.  The piece in Time magazine that speaks about how in the – just a few years, I think somewhere around 2034, somewhere in there, man will become immortal is what they’re teaching.

Now, this is all a part of this trans-humanism concept.  And you can see where the idea of a superhuman “Christian”, the manifested sons of God, will be these superhuman people.  Now, this comes from a vineyard prophesy school from 1989.  Listen to this.  “God has invited us to have a role in establishing this new order of Christianity.”

Well, isn’t that interesting? They keep calling for a new order.  Who else is calling for a new world order?  Well, we hear that Alice Bailey and her demon that she was consulting with, the Tibetan, were talking about the new world order.  And it would come about how?  Through the church.  And what would the church do?  The church would put away the cross.  The church would put away their savior, and they would become more ecumenical. 

Hmm.  Sounds like the new apostolic reformation that’s really put away the gospel and is really only interested in the great commission, not preaching the laws, but the great commission being awakening the church to take back the culture and the country and the nation and every social and political institution.

So here we have the Vineyard Prophesy School of 1989, God has invited us to have a role in establishing this new order.  Come back I’ll explain more about that new order and who will be the enemy of the new order.  Can you guess?  Yeah, it’s you.

We’ll be right back.

[Music]                      

Welcome back to the program.  Glad you're with us.  Brannon Howse here.  Our website’s worldviewweekend.com.  Worldviewweekend.com.  You’ll find our entire four-part series on the dangers of the new apostolic reformation, Dominion Theology Part 1, 2, 3 and 4 at worldviewweekend.com. 

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Before we went to the break, I said that the Vineyard Prophesy School of 1989 said God has invited us to have a role in establishing this new order of Christianity.  God is offering something to this generation something he’s never offered to any other generation before.  He’s giving us an open invitation to participate in something that will lead to the prize of all the ages.  It’s greater than anything he’s ever done from Adam, clear down through the millennium.

So now you can be, folks, a part of building the new order if you agree with them.  But if you don’t agree with them then guess what?  You are going to be the enemy.  They’re going to come against you, and there’s going to be a civil war in the church.  We’ll get to that in just a minute.

Listen to this quote by – it’s called “The Harvest”.  It’s written by Rick Joyner.  Someone called in last week and said, “Oh, Rick Joyner is not a part of this.” Well, hmm.  You get a copy of the book by Pastor Bill Randles, Beware the New Prophet, subtitled A Caution Concerning the Modern Prophetic Movement, and you’ll find out plenty about Rick Joyner.

Here’s what Rick Joyner writes, according to the book by Pastor Bill.  He says – this is quoting Rick Joyner from his book, The Harvest.  “What is about to come upon the earth is not just a revival or another awakening.  It is a revolution.  This vision was given in order to begin awakening those who are destined to radically change the course and even the very definition of Christianity.”

Do we need a new definition of Christianity?  Rick Joyner goes on to write on Page 36 and 38 of the book, The Harvest, published by Whitaker House, “If the leaders resist this movement” – and who are the leaders?  It becomes clear to me he means Christian leaders, any Christian leaders who resist this movement, look out.  “If the leaders resist this movement, the lord will continue to move through the congregations.  These groups will begin to relate to other members of the body of Christ, and their bonds will grow stronger, regardless of the opposition from resistant pastors.  The pastors and leaders who continue to resist this tide of unity will be removed from their place.  Some that were greatly used of God in the past have become too rigid in doctrinal emphasis.” 

Ooh, red flag.  They become too rigid in doctrinal emphasis.  In other words, their doctrinal foundation is keeping there from being unity.  Well, is not that the issue for you and I?  Is this not what is causing me to say I cannot unite with them, I cannot join with them, in fact I must warn about them is my doctrine?  Yeah.  So now I would be considered too rigid.

And while I’m not a pastor, it does say that those pastors who are resistant to this, well, God is going to remove them.  He’s going to take them out.  In fact, I’m not going to reveal the name now because I’m doing more research, but I’ll tell you this, one well-known Christian leader, if I said his name 99 percent of you would know who I’m talking about, said to me once not too long ago, “Those who” – and I was trying to find out if this individual was a part of this movement.  And I asked this individual, I said, “Now, do you believe that a great awakening is coming, or do you believe God is going to judge our nation? Which one do you believe?”

“Well,” he said, “I think you’d do the same thing regardless.”  And I said, “Well, I would agree with that.  You proclaim the gospel, and there’s the process, the nation turns back, great.  If not and God judges America, you still proclaim the gospel.  So we would agree on that.”

But the comment went on to be that those who are involved in restoring the country will receive great blessing.  Those who have not taken part in the restoration of the country back to our founders, back to the purpose of our government, back to a Christian foundation, those who have not been a part of it but have actually said, such as myself, it ain’t happening people.  The culture war is lost. 

We’re not going back to the days of June and Ward Cleaver.  We’re not going to see abortion outlawed.  Does that mean I still oppose abortion?  You bet I do because it goes against the character nature of God.  I oppose abortion whether I know they’re going to ever outlaw it or not.  I don’t oppose something because I know I’m going to win.  I oppose something because I have to judge whether it’s consistent with God’s character or not.

So I don’t look at the issue of abortion and say, “Well, we’re going to win that one, so I’ll fight it.”  Or I look at another issue like ______ ______, and say, “Well, we’re not going to win that one, so I won’t fight it.”  No, we fight for what is right, and what is right or righteous is based on the character nature of God.

But this individual told me those who partake in this movement will be blessed with greater leadership.  Those who have opposed it will not be allowed to take part in it.  And I thought to myself, “That’s odd.”  So virtually what you’re saying is if I don’t get behind the movement and agree with you that this can happen and push for it and fight for it, I prefer to stay here and say this is what the Bible says on theology and doctrine, and this is the job of the church is to proclaim the gospel. 

Yes, we should go vote.  Yes, we should make a phone call when we can about legislation.  Yes, if God’s call you to even work with a member of your state legislature and draft legislation to protect homeschooling and Christian schools and ______ authority, great.  But we don’t put all our eggs in one basket.  Our whole calling is not to be involved in Christian activism.  It’s not either/or.  It’s, yes, we’re involved in Christian activism, but it’s got to be balanced with our ultimate calling, which is what?  First priority, Paul says, the preaching of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. 

It’s got to be in context.  It’s got to be in balance.  So what you’re saying is if I don’t partake in the work to restore the country to the Christian roots when that happens, and if it does happen, this Christian leader said to me, God will not allow those who are not part of it or those who were critical of it, those who were more doomsday, God will not allow them to take part in the leadership.  They will not take part in the blessing.  Their role, their leadership will be diminished.  It’ll be gone.  That’ll be their judgment for having not been a part of this.

Really? I was a little shocked by that.  But this is exactly what Rick Joyner is saying in The Harvest.  These pastors who don’t get onboard, God is going to do something with them, and they’re going to be taken out.  So he goes on to say, backing up a little bit, “The pastors and leaders who continue to resist this tide of unity will be removed from their place.  Some that were greatly used of God in the past have become too rigid in doctrinal emphasis.”

I’ve got to stop there again because this reminds me, isn’t that indeed what people were saying to me and to you who opposed Glenn Beck’s Restore Honor Rally, that we were being too rigid?  You know what, Brannon, we can deal with the theological and doctrinal issues later.  Let’s reclaim the country first because if we don’t reclaim the country, there’ll be no religious liberty.

Oh, I see, so our obedience to scripture is based on pragmatism.  Okay.  I’ll be obedient to theology and doctrine, 2 Corinthians 6:14, “What fellowship does righteousness have with unrighteousness, light with darkness.”  2 John 9:11, “Those who come to you bringing another gospel or something other than the doctrines of Christ, don’t greet them.  Don’t invite them into your home unless you partake in their evil deeds.”

Hmm, so I will obey those when it fits my agenda, and right now my agenda is reclaiming the country . Then after we reclaim the country, Brannon, we can get around to dealing with the theology and doctrine, of which you disagree with Glenn Beck.  That is what people were e-mailing me, and that is exactly what he’s saying here.

Some in the – have become too rigid in doctrinal emphasis to participate in this revival.  What did Glenn Beck call it?  “Third-grade awakening.”  What have some Christian leaders called it?  “The beginning of a third-grade awakening.”  So this revival is taking place, but some of us have become too rigid in our doctrine, and we’ve criticized them partaking with Glenn Beck in this unity.

Those who are – and by the way, a lot of those folks that were involved with Glenn Beck and this whole thing, I’m learning as I do more research, big time into dominion theology.  Big time into dominion theology. And if you watch what they’ve been doing over the years, they have no problem coming together with a lot of different religions.

So they were too rigid in their doctrine to participate in this revival.  Those who were linked together by doctrine or gathered around personalities will be quickly torn away.  Some leaders will actual disband their organizations as they realize they’re no longer relevant to what God is doing.  Really?

So those who have an organization, like ours, that is built on the foundation of looking at the word of God in context, theology and doctrine, applying it to everyday life, proclamation of the gospel, learning how to use the moral law like Jesus did, evangelize people, apply biblical principles to our family and how we respond to a government that’s coming against us, so that we might act biblically and thereby lifting up the gospel.  So all of that becomes irrelevant, huh?

So God is going to all of the sudden quit working with organizations like ours.  So is the gospel going to become irrelevant if our organization is?  No.  He goes on to say, Rick Joyner, “A group company of prophets, teachers, pastors and apostles will be raised up.  This harvest will be so great, that no one will be able to look back at the early church as a standard.”

Oop, red flag.  Red flag.  “No one will be able to look back at the early church as a standard.  All will be saying that the lord saved the best for last.”  Well, isn’t it interesting that the world is going to save the best for last for Rick Joyner and his crowd.  Hmm.  If you don’t think these people are so full of themselves – and reality is, in my opinion, from my research, this is what this is all about.  In the end, this is all about them.  This is all about them, them harvesting power and influence and control.  It’s about them building a kingdom for their selves.

In reality, I think they’re helping build Satan’s kingdom.  But when they say – when he says no one will be able to look back at the early church as a standard, you've got a real problem because everything that a prophet or apostle was to do was supposed to agree with the scriptures.  A prophet had to agree with what the apostles taught, so he’s acknowledging right here that these modern prophets won’t give two hoots about what the apostles laid down first.

So here’s a real sign right now they’re false prophets.  That someone like Rick Joyner is a false prophet because he’s saying, “No one will be able to look back at the early church as a standard.”  Well, if he’s claiming to be a prophet, then right now he’s proven he’s a false prophet because one of the requirements of a prophet is whatever they teach is consistent with what the apostles have laid down, the doctrine.

He goes on to say, Rick Joyner in The Harvest, “Some pastors will continue to resist this tide of unity.  They will be removed from their place.  Some will be so hardened, they will become opposers and resist God to the end.”  Whoa, wait a minute.  Those of us who say we’re not going along with you guys, you’re heretics, we will now be called opposers who are resisting God to the end.

He goes on to say, “This is the year when the lord starts to bring down the spirit of Jezebel.  He will begin by calling her to repentance.”  Really?  What do they mean by that?  “Those who have been vessels for the spirit and who do not repent will be displayed as so insane that even the most immature Christians will discern their sickness.”

Isn’t that interesting that this false dominant church is going to declare Bible-believing, theologically, doctrinally sound Christians as insane?  Hmm.  And who else might declare Bible-believing, conservative, theologically, doctrinally sound Christians insane, hmm?  Maybe the government.  Maybe the report put out by the Department of Homeland Security that if you study end time prophecy you’re an extremist?  Maybe we go back to the writing sort of someone like – let’s see, someone I wrote about in the book Grave Influence, Sigmund Freud, who claimed that Christians were the crazy ones.

So the reality is, what have I told you before?  The false dominant church will be pointing to the real bride of Christ and say, “They’re crazy.”  And the government will be saying, “Yep, they’re crazy.”  Why?   Because they’re opposing the new order.  Those groups are pushing for ecumenicalism, a new order, pagan spirituality.  And the false dominant church is going to turn and say, “They’re insane.”  The government will be saying, “Yeah, we agree.”  Wow.

We will be back with more.  Don’t go away.

[music]                        Welcome back, my friends, to the program.  Glad you’re with us.  Brannon Howse here.  It’s Worldview Weekend.  Our website is worldviewweekend.com.  Worldviewweekend.com.

Over the weekend I started reading a book that I ordered, and it’s called Beware the New Prophets.  It’s written by an independent Pentecostal pastor who is saying, look, these guys are false apostles and false prophets.  And he lays the case out. 

So it’s – like I said, I wouldn’t agree necessarily with everything that Pastor Bill Randles would maybe believe in his Pentecostalism.  But has he done a good job in writing a book exposing the false prophets and apostles?  Yeah, he has.  And he’s done a good work here in putting it together, and I appreciate that.

So I’m laying out for you who these guys are and what some of them believe.  Because, again, someone last week called and said, “Well, Rick Joyner, he’s not a part of all of this.”  Really? 

Well, listen to this, in his book The Final Quest, published by Whitaker House, the last prophecy – this is – excuse me, 158-page prophecy that has come by Rick Joyner.  And he refers to “some strategic revelations.”  This is what he’s talking about, as a quote,  “some strategic revelations.”  What he had here was a vision, and he is calling for “the great Christian civil war.”  The great Christian civil war.

And Pastor Bill says, “The blues in the army have been interpreted as those who are operating on revelation knowledge.  Blue being symbolic of heaven.  The grays are still operating out of their heads.  Gray matter, the brain.  Get it?”  He says.  “The gray army of Christians are seeking to hold the church in ‘spiritual slavery’,” and spiritual slavery is in quotes.

So remember I told you last week that Joyner is calling for a Christian civil war, a great Christian civil war.  Here you go.  And this is – in my research, I believe that this is the false dominant church, led by these false apostles, false prophets coming against the true church.  And Jesus himself warned of this, did he not?  For such will be false apostles, masquerading as what?  Apostles of Christ.

He says a figure known as the Angel Wisdom, a figure Joyner knows as the Angel Wisdom, that’s capital “A”, capital “W” for wisdom, guides Joyner through his vision, which is full of interesting details such as talking eagles ascending a multilevel mountain and arrows, which represent biblical truth.

This guy’s claim is that he’s visited Paradise, folks.  And we’re the crazy ones.  And he says we’re the ones that are going to be insane.  Talking angels, and I’m insane.  Hmm.

As Joyner ponders the meaning of his vision, he writes these words, “A great civil war now looms before the church.  The lord is now preparing a leadership that will be willing to fight a civil war in order to set men free.  The main issue will be slavery versus freedom.  The church will not be destroyed, but the institutions and doctrines that have kept them in spiritual slavery will be.”  Really?  What doctrines would those be?  Again, remember the quote earlier of those who are holding on to doctrines too rigidly.

So he says, “The institutions and doctrines that have kept men in slavery will be destroyed, even after this perfect justice in the church” – excuse me, let’s back up.  “Even after this, perfect justice in the church will not be attained overnight.  There will be struggles for women’s rights and to set the church free from other forms of racism and exploitation.”

Hmm.  I wonder if one of the issues of women’s rights will then be the fact that those of us who hold too strong to doctrine say, you know what, a woman shouldn’t be up preaching.  Because if you look at Cindy Jacobs, isn’t she an apostle at large?  And isn’t she out there preaching and prophesying?  So is oppression of women now because – or lack of women’s rights because some hold to the biblical doctrine that, hey, women shouldn’t be up preaching.

So this is the old order.  He talks about the old older.  And they talk a lot about “perfect justice”.  He talks about the Angel Wisdom who came to him as a talking eagle.  The Angel Wisdom teachers Joyner and the church, this is from his book, “The lord dwells within.  You have taught this many times, but now must live it for you have eaten of the Tree of Life.”

“The angel then began to lead me back to the gate of Paradise.  I protested that I didn’t want to leave.”  See, he’s taken a trip to Paradise.  And this is not an allegory, according to Pastor Bill, who studied it.  He really thinks he went to Paradise.  “I protested that I didn’t want to leave.  Looking surprised, the angel took me by the shoulders and looked me in the eyes.  That is when I recognized him as the Angel Wisdom.  ‘You never have to leave this garden. This garden is in your heart because the creator himself is within you.’” 

Pastor goes on to say, “He claims, Joyner, to have interacted with angels, had visions, talked to spiritual eagles who talked back to him, and like the mystics of old, climbed the holy mountain.”  Do you know these guys also believe one of their supposed prophets, Prophets in the Prophetic Movement by Bill Hamon, Page 166, he says, “The president of the United States and heads of nation will begin to seek out the Christian prophets and prophetic ministers to find out what is really taking place and how to know what to do.”

Well, I would venture to guess that indeed if this – these shenanigans hang around, that indeed, world leaders will seek out these guys to ask them what to do because I believe they will be some of the false apostles and prophets spoken of in the scripture, and that system, that false church, that harlot church, that woman who rides the beast will be used to help usher in the new world order, as they all want.  So it doesn’t – it would not surprise me if world leaders seek these guys out because they’re going to use them.  That’s this religious Trojan horse.

Listen, here’s another comment by Bill Hamon.  “When the prophets have finished their ministry, he,” meaning Christ, “will be released to descend from heaven with a shout, and be fully and eternally reunited with his bride.”  So, again, Christ cannot return, folks, until these guys do their work, and if you oppose them you’re in big trouble.  If you oppose them then you need to be dealt with.  And if you aren’t part of helping establish this kingdom on earth, then when it does come, God is not going to bless you with any power or position.  You’re going to be done.  You’re finished.  And we need a great civil war to go between the blues and the grays, the grays being those are still thinking with their mind.

“Love the lord God with all your heart, soul, strength and mind.” 

1-800-347-9829 is the number if you want to comment or question.  1-800-347-9829.  1-800-347-9829 is the number.  While you’re getting onboard I’ve got a few more things for you.  1-800-347-9829.  Now, again, I’ll give it.  1-800-347-9829.

Okay.  Now, I believe that the ecumenicalism that’s coming, and it’s really here quite frankly when you've got Rick Warren and these guys signing – Bill Hybels and others signing onto the Yale document that Muslims and Christians worship the same God.  This ecumenicalism is here.  But we – I believe truly that this movement of the Protestants and the Catholics is going to great increase.  And one of the people that have been pushing this is C. Peter Wagner.  And of course C. Peter Wagner is one of the guys behind the new apostolic reformation.

Listen to what C. Peter Wagner writes.  He said, “Traditionally the message of the gospel in Latin America has appealed to the working class, but changes have begun to take place, and many middle and upper-class people are now opening their hearts to Jesus Christ.  Some of this is happening through the Catholic charismatic movement.  That’s C. Peter Wagner writing back in 1983.

And he’s really big into that and to the Catholics and evangelicals coming together.  What are we coming together on, folks?  Are we coming together where we can agree on theology and doctrine?  Because we can’t.  We can’t come together and agree on theology and doctrine with the emergent church inside the protestant church.  We can’t come together and agree with the Pope on much of what he says because it doesn’t line up with theology and doctrine. This is why we had people like William Tyndale.  This is why we had people like John Wycliffe because they were going back to the word of God. 

I watched an incredible documentary this weekend on Wycliffe and on Tyndale. And I’ll be doing more on that later.  But one of the things that I really believe, as you guys are getting on the line, we’ll go to the phones, is that the things, the characteristics – and some of you have e-mailed me this to point this out as well, you’re thinking correctly.  You’re thinking.  That’s the key.  No one does that today hardly anymore.  You’re thinking, and one of the things some of you have e-mailed me and said, hey, you notice how the characteristics of dominion theology inside the Protestant church really lines up with what many within the Catholic church believe, what the Catholic church is promoting?

Let me give you a couple of examples.  We’ll go to the phone.  A promotion of a social gospel and social justice instead of biblically evangelizing the lost.  Is that not dominion theology, one of the characteristics we gave last week?  Yes.  Is that not also what we see in the Catholic church?  Yes.  Can we see the Protestants and the – the Protestants in this movement, emergent church, new apostolic reformation, their joint connection in promotion of pagan spirituality, social justice, can we not see them hooking up with other folks inside the Catholic church together on this basis?  Absolutely.

Here’s another one where the new apostolic reformation and the Catholic church and the emergent church can all agree a promotion of ecumenicalism through which all religions of the world can work together to solve the world’s problems.  And I’ve got quotes in this new book where the Pope is saying everybody – this book and the last one – everybody ought to learn from the Hindus.  Hinduism is a great thing. Let’s all learn from the Hindus.

We’ve got him kissing the Koran.  A picture of him – the last Pope kissing the Koran.

Here’s another characteristic, a commitment to a communitarian philosophy that seeks to bring the church, the government and corporations into an equal partnership together in order to solve the problems of the world and bring global peace and stability.  Yes, have you not read the 30,000-word ______ of the – of this Pope where he’s calling for a word tax and redistribution of wealth and the need to redistribute natural resources around the world?  Totally communitarianism.

How about this one?  The belief that God is giving new revelations to man, and these new revelations are equal to the word of God.  That’s what the dominion theology crowd believes.  Folks, that’s what the Catholic church teaches.  Confession – this is from their confession.  This is ______ ______ ______, Articles IV, I and XI.  Listen to this, and then we’ll go to the phones.  “We” – this is the Catholic church now.  “We confess that whatever new thing” – by the way, who is always using that phrase God is doing a new thing, a new thing?  The new apostolic reformation crowd.

But here’s the Catholic church. “We confess that whatsoever new thing the Pope of Rome may have instituted, whether it be in scripture or out of scripture is true, divine.  And therefore, ought to be regarded as of higher value by laypeople than the precepts of the living God.  We confess that the Pope has the power of altering scriptures or increasing and diminishing it according to his will.  We confess that the holy scripture is imperfect.  We confess” – again, let me back up, “We confess that the holy scripture is imperfect, and a dead letter until it’s explained by the supreme pontiff and permitted by him to be read by people.”

Do they believe in new revelations?  Absolutely.  A promotion of pagan spiritual practices allow individuals to have access to these new revelations of God.  That’s a new apostolic reformation.  That’s what we’ve got going on too in the Catholic church, as you pray to Mary, as you pray to saints.  I believe that apostles and prophets are for today.  Well, yes, what do they think the Pope is?  He’s a continuation of the apostles.

“The blatant hostility toward Christians that refuse to accept their esoteric revelations, self-appointed authority and globalist agenda.”  Yeah.  William Tyndale, John Wycliffe, Martin Luther.  We’ve seen that hostility.  “A blatant and deceptive strategy of using traditional terms that have new meanings as defined by the leaders of dominion theology, or you could say as defined by the Catholic church.

The point I’m making is these religious groups can come together.  They’re uniting.  We’re seeing it.  It’s that false dominant church.  Don’t get upset because I say Catholic because I’m saying just as much about the Protestant church, folks.  All right.

When you come back, we’re going to go to Adam and Rachel and Stacy and Judy.  You guys hold on.  We’ll be right back.  I’m Brannon Howse.  This is Worldview Weekend Radio.

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Welcome back to the program.  Glad you are with us.  All right.  We promised you we’d go through the – to these callers.  Let’s roll through as many as we can.  We’ve got Adam calling in.  Adam, thank you for listening to the program and thank you for calling in.  Go right ahead, sir.

Brannon Howse:         Or a Mormon.

Brannon Howse:         I agree.  And what do they mean by great commission, Adam?  Because as we saw last week, great commission for some of these guys in the apostolic reformation, these “prophets and apostles”, is that you awaken the church to take back the culture and the government and the social and political sphere.  It’s not that you reach out to the unsaved with the gospel.  So we have to ask what does Promise Keepers mean by the great commission.”

Brannon Howse:         Exactly.  What Jesus?  Is it the Jesus of the Mormons?  Is it the Jesus of the Jehovah’s Witnesses?  Is it the Jesus of the Bible. Absolutely, Adam. Adam, good call.  Thank you for going to that website and bringing that attention to us.  Thank you so much, sir.

Let’s run real quick and see if we can get through all these calls.  Rachel.  Rachel from Racine.  Welcome to the program.  Thank you for calling in.

Brannon Howse:         Thank you.  Number three I have, and I just disagree with him on that as far as the antichrist being a Muslim, but I could be dead wrong.  I’m not going to be dogmatic on it.

Number two, I’m not familiar with that history of the Evangelical Free Church of America and that going on over there, so I would have to look into that.  But number one, I don’t have a problem being in ministry.  It’s women being pastors.  It’s them being in the pulpit, them teaching over men.  No problem with a godly lady teaching the word of God to women.  No problem there.  It’s them teaching to men and them teaching in the pulpit.

Now, are we talking about something at a conference setting?  I’m talking about a woman being in the role of pastor in a church, not what the scriptures show for us at all.

But number two, I can’t really address that because I don’t know that history.  That’s very interesting.  But I was able to answer one and two for you.  I hope that helps.  Or one and three.

Let’s go to Stacy in Florida.  Stacy, welcome to the program.  Thank you for calling in.

Brannon Howse:         I need to do a little more research in that, but I would say right now, no, we don’t get new extra biblical revelations, if that’s what you’re asking.  We do not get new extra biblical revelations.  No, I don’t – my quick answer would be no.  We don’t have visions and dreams today.  I – really because when these folks talk about visions and dreams, they’re talking about extra biblical revelations, and many of them are looking for a vision, and they’re going into contemplative prayer and transcendental meditation, and they’re looking for a voice or a vision, and they’re fooling around with the occult.

All we need to do is study our Bibles and rely on the ministry of the Holy Spirit.  We’re not to add to or take from.  There are judgments that come to people who do that.  So I would have to say no.  We should not be looking for visions and dreams.  We don’t need anything beyond the word of God, ______ ______, scripture alone. 

Does that mean we don’t rely on the ministry of the Holy Spirit to help us understand things?  Does that mean we don’t have the body of Christ for people to have spiritual gifts and the spiritual gifts of someone that has the ability to really look at scripture and dig it out and see things that maybe others don’t see because they’ve studied the scripture in context?  They have the real gift.  Like John McArthur has a real gift.  Some could say Charles Stanley has a real gift.  These are gifted men given to the church.

Do we really on that as the body of Christ in Ephesians 4?  Absolutely.  But to say that we need to have visions and dreams, no, I would say that’s very suspect to me.  Very suspect based on my understanding of scripture, and I hope that helps.

You know, Rachel did ask me a question a while ago about the difference between Jimmy Swaggart and today.  Well, all of that, by the way, a lot of that’s been based on this foundation that was laid by this guy William Branham who saw an angel years ago and laid the foundation for people like Oral Roberts. 

Why are they more dangerous?  They’re not really more dangerous, Rachel, to answer your question.  It just popped in my mind that I hadn’t done that.  It is that this is becoming more mainstream, i.e., you have Richard Land of the Southern Baptist Convention on the platform of Liberty University with Cindy Jacobs.  I mean, come on.

The danger is that has now gone mainstream.  People used to look at some of those folks and realize they’re – this is not sound.  This is not theologically and doctrinally sound.  Today it’s gone mainstream, as Adam was saying.  All the denominations are now going to come together.  Well, how are you going to do that? You drop theology and doctrine.  Or as Rick Joyner said, some have been too rigid on their doctrine.

So there you go.  There’s a lot more to cover, but thanks for listening.  Judy, sorry we didn’t get to you.

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